satanic lies.

I have only one question for the writer of this article: What color is the sky in your world?

Has no one in the world today heard of satire? *facepalm*

+1 to Michael Iafrate for linking to this post. I laughed, albeit somewhat nervously – not the uproarious laughter at the telling of a good joke, but the cautious chuckle of a satire that is perhaps closer to the truth in some ways than one would prefer.

I see what you did there.

Nice.

There is a viral e-mail circulating for a few years now on the subject of “profiling”, specifically profiling people who might be terrorist suspects at airports. In light of very recent news, it has come around again. The point of the e-mail is that all of the people responsible for what we have come to call terrorist attacks are Muslim males between the ages of 19 and forty. Well, that is not correct, there are now several dozen women to add to the mix of Muslim male terrorist attacks.

I have read that there have been somewhere near 14,000 of these kind of things in the past few years; most of them, oddly enough, committed by Muslims against Muslims, but enough committed against non-Muslims to get one’s attention. The magazine Touchstone used to print accounts of the latest outrages against non-Muslims by Muslims every month. I think they stopped because it may have been getting tiresome.

Now I read that last year 39 Catholic priests and missionaries were murdered, most of them by Muslims, and I await the statistics on the number of Muslim Imams murdered by young Catholic men in the past year.

In Iraq, you probably know, the “ethnic cleansing” of Christians goes on un-abated under the benevolent gaze of the US supported government. It is a process not unlike the one which took place in the former Indonesian province of East Timor where, in the name of Allah, thousands of Christians (most of them Catholics) were slaughtered. The fiction that the deaths were merely a political response to an illegal independence movement was maintained by one and all for years.

Shall I go on?

I think not. It becomes tiresome.

I still do not understand your point, Sir, and wish I could find some merit in what you wrote.

Hello Ned,

Where shall I begin? First I will begin with a confession. I confess that I am ignorant of what in heaven’s name is that thing called the Westboro Baptist Church. I will further confess that I am ignorant of the fact that Hitler called himself a Christian; he the author of policies that resulted in the deaths of thousands of Catholic priests and protestant ministers, and millions of Christians, not to mention millions of Jews. I will further confess that until you mentioned it I was ignorant of the fact that “the Church and the Jewish people have been at the helm of far more deaths than the nation of Islam.” As a matter of fact I think you made up that stuff about Hitler and Christians and Jews.

I shall not count coup with you about this, but simply say that you are wrong. Go read a book.

I reject your thesis that I have fallen victim to anything that you name in your first paragraph. The 14,000 figure that I mentioned referred specifically and solely to acts of terror committed by Muslims against Muslims or people of other religions; Muslims who invoked the name of their god and their prophet whilst planning and carrying out their acts. Shall I give the lie to them and say they are something else? If they are, where then are the “normative” Muslims saying that these men are not Muslim? What I hear are excuses and victimological statements from bodies like CAIR. The rest is a blank wall of silence.

As regards loud voices and normative ones, is it normative for a muslim to drive out people of other faiths from an area they want, to issue death threats to those who won’t convert to Islam, to practice kidnap and rape of young women and force them into marriage and conversion, to sentence women to be gang raped, to enslave, to slaughter populations, to demand young men in tribute for their armies from subjugated tribes, nations and peoples, to believe that lying to a non-muslim is the best thing one can do, especially if you are seeking to lull them into feeling they can trust you?

If it is not, then for 1400 odd years the un-normative muslims have had a pretty active run of things. I should think that the normative voices in Islam would want to speak up and set the record straight, get the un-normative ones in line or boot them out.

But, you see, that can’t be the case with Islam, because, well, when you come right down to it, it’s sort of whatever your mind tells you it ought to be, especially all of that stuff about killing infidels and raping virgins and enslaving the dhimmis; that’s you and me. It’s a kind of anything goes religion, as long as Allah the Merciful says it can, and what he says is that anything goes for a good muslim when it comes to non-muslims. No? Can you say sharia law, or the dar ul haq and dar ul harb or whatever it is?

Now that’s a heck of a strange god don’t you think? I mean what self respecting god goes to the trouble of creating one species of folks and telling some of ‘em, “It’s quite all right Mahmoud if you rape and or kill everyone in sight who hasn’t or won’t join the club, I see nothing wrong with that. After all the only good infidel is a dead one.”

Makes the average one toothed KKK wing nut sound exactly what he is, laughably stupid.

I’ve enjoyed the exchange, but really, Ned, you ought to come to the game ready to play.

And, no, I don’t. The Law was done away with by the Resurrection. I try to follow the greatest commandment and its second. Sometimes I find that very hard to do, but I know Jesus died for my sins and will forgive me in the Sacrament of Confession.

TTFN,
Peadar Ban

Peadar Ban:

First I will begin with a confession. I confess that I am ignorant of what in heaven’s name is that thing called the Westboro Baptist Church.

Geez, man. Check out the news every once in a while. I think basically everyone, be it people who get their news online, from NPR, from CNN, from FOX News, from Drudge Report, or wherever, are aware of who WBC is and what they represent. Such ignorance is, of course, your choice, but it is probably not recommended when in a discussion of this sort because it makes you look not only completely biased (i.e. unaware of obvious counter-examples to your arguments) but also helplessly ignorant of well-known events that affect our lives not only as members of American society but certainly as people who call ourselves Christians.

Peadar Ban:

I will further confess that I am ignorant of the fact that Hitler called himself a Christian; he the author of policies that resulted in the deaths of thousands of Catholic priests and protestant ministers, and millions of Christians, not to mention millions of Jews.

For one, anti-semitism in Europe has always been strongly tied with Christianity. For two, the policies which led to the deaths of Christian ministers and priests were incidental, not purposely constructed to do so. They were killed for going against other policies by harboring Jews or speaking against the Nazi regime. Your implication is that Hitler and the Nazi regime was somehow explicitly anti-Christian because they ended up killing a notable number of Christians and Christian leadership along with the millions of Jews and other people. However, as far as I know, it is rather commonly known that Hitler did at least entitle himself to the label “Christian,” as did the majority of people in the Nazi party. After all, Germany was at that time, and for quite a while after through to today, a predominantly Christian party. Twisting of Christian theology is what actually led to many of the Nazi policies.

Peadar Ban:

I will further confess that until you mentioned it I was ignorant of the fact that “the Church and the Jewish people have been at the helm of far more deaths than the nation of Islam.”

Watch.

Peadar Ban:
As a matter of fact I think you made up that stuff about Hitler and Christians and Jews.

Nope. And easily confirmed by using Google or Wikipedia. This isn’t quantum physics here, just general know-how and application of intellect.

Let me take a stab at something here:

Peadar Ban:

As regards loud voices and normative ones, is it normative for a Christian to drive out people of other faiths from an area they want, to issue death threats to those who won’t convert to Christianity, to practice kidnap and rape of young women and force them into marriage and conversion, to sentence women to be gang raped, to enslave, to slaughter populations, to demand young men in tribute for their armies from subjugated tribes, nations and peoples, to believe that lying to a non-Christian is the best thing one can do, especially if you are seeking to lull them into feeling they can trust you?
If it is not, then for 1400 odd years the un-normative Christians have had a pretty active run of things. I should think that the normative voices in Christianity would want to speak up and set the record straight, get the un-normative ones in line or boot them out.
But, you see, that can’t be the case with Christianity, because, well, when you come right down to it, it’s sort of whatever your mind tells you it ought to be, especially all of that stuff about killing infidels and raping virgins and enslaving the gentiles; that’s you and me. It’s a kind of anything goes religion, as long as YHWH says it can, and what he says is that anything goes for a good Christian when it comes to non-Christians. No? Can you say the entire Old Testament, or the entire history of Christendom in the Wt?
Now that’s a heck of a strange god don’t you think? I mean what self respecting god goes to the trouble of creating one species of folks and telling some of ‘em, “It’s quite all right Abrham if you rape and or kill everyone in sight who hasn’t or won’t join the club, I see nothing wrong with that. After all the only good infidel is a dead one.”

Yup. It’s a perfect fit! And if you think I’m just being crass, try reading the Old Testament or, I dunno, any book of history about the past 2,000 years. Ever hear of Constantine systematically persecuting and executing non-Christians after establishing Christianity as the official religion of Rome? Ever read any early American literature about what the early American Christian settler did not only to the Native Americans, but to members of their own communities who dared voice dissent or were ever accused of anything as vague and ridiculous as “being a witch”? And those are just a few of countless examples.

Peadar Ban:

Makes the average one toothed KKK wing nut sound exactly what he is, laughably stupid.

Are you trying to paint violent, militant, organized, hateful, disgraceful racists as less reprehensible or somehow belonging to some tier of not-really-so-bad hate and violence? All hate and violence is wrong, be it Muslim, Christian, Hindu, atheist or otherwise. Why even bother trying to set up some sort of comparative scale system?

Peadar Ban:

And, no, I don’t. The Law was done away with by the Resurrection. I try to follow the greatest commandment and its second. Sometimes I find that very hard to do, but I know Jesus died for my sins and will forgive me in the Sacrament of Confession.

For God’s sake, just shut up. On it’s own, there’s absolutely nothing wrong with this quote, but in context of the rest of the filth you spewed, it is a shame to other people who are unwillingly associated with you by the term “Christian” and it is a disgrace to you because you’re only making yourself look like a hateful bigot and utter fool.

The point is that even if everything you spindoctored about Islam were truly just as you presented it, and even if Christianity were, as a whole, innocent of any of those same charges, what would be the point of talking about it as you do? What would be the point of casting judgments and making closed-minded, hateful statements? You claim outright that you try to follow the two great commandments given by Jesus, but what does your spreading of hate toward Muslims and their religion have anything to do with either commandment? I’m pretty sure that serving the Lord God with all your heart, mind, and soul involves loving other people just as Jesus loved them, which means for who they are, just how they are. And this doesn’t include castigating them for what you perceive are their shortcomings or faults (unless, of course, they are besmirching the name of God or Jesus by false prophecy or horrible theology — something that you yourself are doing, though obviously you have no fear that Muslims are doing since you don’t seem to understand that Allah is God and God is Allah, historically, linguistically, culturally, and religiously i.e. according to the Qu’ran). Even if all this bile you spread here wasn’t completely false, you’d still have nothing from the Bible or otherwise to back up your actions here.

Thom:

Thanks, David. I didn’t have the patience.

I see what he did there. That was very good.

Did that guy REALLY tell me to go read a book? Bahahaha!

Are you willfully ignorant or just in love with attention?

I am quite sorry I followed a link to this page. This has been an astounding waste of time. You most certainly should get a doctorate and teach at a seminary – you’ll excel at teaching worthless, inane ideas with a “prophetic” voice to people ignorant enough to take you seriously.

Does no one today understand what satire is?

It’s all gone downhill since we stopped teaching “A Modest Proposal” in English lit.

Wow. That’s weird. When I posted, I was doing so on a page that had been open the night before, and actually hadn’t read Nick’s message. The fact that we both mentioned Swift is kind of funny in that light.

It occurs to me to respond in two ways:
First, Christianity was remarkably peaceful-for the first 400 years or so. Even after that, it inspired such things as banning warfare between Thursday-Tuesday (in recognition of the Sabbath), and having religious authority higher than civil authority (so that the wars could be settled in the Vatican, not on the battlefield).

That changed with the Islamic invasions of Europe- from the Moors in Gaul to the Turkish Ottoman Empire. Some of the worst Christianity has done, was in response to that: The Spanish Inquisition, the Crusades, Vlad the Impaler (the inspiration for Dracula), etc.

The other thing I’d point out (and have on my own blog) is that Islamics in general are not terrorists- but there’s a protestant reformation going on in Islam, and one of the sects, the muwahiddun, contains a rather unique theology that is a rough analogy to Protestant Christianity’s five solas- but without a reasonable God. This in effect makes the individual his own prophet- and given the pillar of Jihad, his own judge and executioner.
http://outsidetheautisticasylum.blogspot.com/2009/12/why-muwahiddun-sect-of-islam-is.html

I consider them as dangerous as any Christian Fundamentalist, who believing themselves to be the Pope, take verses out of context of the Bible. So the Muwahiddun do with the Koran. And with NO human authority between them and God, there’s nobody to tell them that they are wrong.

Some questions: Are all religions equally guilty of promoting violence? Are some religions more violent than others? Are the categories of praxis and doctrine capable of being compared? Can one critique the doctrines and/or practices of one or several religions without condemning its/their followers?

As I wrote on this subject on my blog- it isn’t Islamics interpreting the Koran correctly and in the light of a school of scholarship that is the problem.

It’s a form of sola scriptura that has taken hold in a single fundamentalist, highly volatile and violent sect, The Muwahiddun, in Saudi Arabia that is the primary problem. Over the past 200 years, their battle to free Mecca from the control of the Saudi Royal Family has spilled over into other areas of the Islamic world, and in the last 20 years, mildly (yes- I’m saying 9-11 was mild in comparison to some of their other attacks internal to the Islamic world) on our Western Banking and Infrastructure (because the Saudi Royal Family is invested in the United States, Spain, Greece, Great Britain, and Germany).

I’m pro-life, and I’m for the entire abortion clinic bomber network to each be given 100 years solitary confinement, in a padded cell with toilet, food slot, steel behind the padding and welded shut.

the tree producing fine fruit is the one that will be left standing.